Emma Mann CYFSN

Justin Barton: [00:00:00] Welcome to the Can You Feel? So now podcast. My name is Justin Barton and I am the luckiest man on earth. I get to sit down with amazing young men and young women who have recently returned from their missions and just. Get warmed around the campfire of their spirit. And today I've got somebody that I have never met until just a few minutes ago.

Justin Barton: Her name is Emma Mann, and I'm just excited to get to know more about her as she shares a little bit about her experiences from her mission. So Emma, why don't you take just a minute, introduce yourself. Tell us where you're from, a little bit about your family, and maybe some hobbies that you enjoy in your life.

Emma Mann: . I'm super happy to be here. I'm Emma. I'm from Washington State, and now I'm a student setting at BYU in Provo. I love the mountains. I love the outdoors. I especially love skiing and running in mountain biking. And when I'm not playing in the mountains, you'll usually find me doing art.

Emma Mann: I like to paint a lot. And yeah, I just got home from my mission about two and a half months ago and I served in Oaxaca, [00:01:00] Mexico, and the funnest part about being home has actually been being with my family. I love them a ton. I come from a family of seven, but two of my brothers already have wives and kids.

Justin Barton: So the family just keeps growing and they're incredible. They're my best friends in the whole world.

Where do you call home in Washington?

Emma Mann: It's cold Woodinville. And most people don't really know where that is.

It's kinda it's kind of by Redmond, Bothell area.

Justin Barton: Okay. Okay. And I live in Spokane, so I'm on the other side of the state from you

Emma Mann: okay. Okay. Very

Justin Barton: cool. A couple of Washingtonians here.

Emma Mann: Perfect. Perfect.

Justin Barton: So what dates did you serve there in Oaxaca, Mexico?

Emma Mann: I started my mission on May 22nd, 2023, and I finished my mission on November 22nd of this past year.

Justin Barton: As you look back at when you started preparing for a mission, what made you decide to serve a mission, and when was that in your life?

Emma Mann: I think deep down, I always knew that I wanted to serve a mission, and I always wanted to [00:02:00] serve a mission because I always knew that Jesus Christ lived.

Emma Mann: That is the most important truth in my life, and it's been. The guiding light in absolutely everything that I've done. And because I've been able to feel that love of Jesus Christ in my life. I've always had this, not only a desire to share the gospel with people, but I also felt a sense of responsibility.

Emma Mann: I feel so blessed to have been born and raised in a family that taught me to follow Jesus Christ. That helped me to develop faith in him, and that was just something that I wanted to share with everybody because. I know that Jesus Christ is the greatest source of joy in my life. And so I wish I could say one day when I was like, oh, I wanna serve a mission.

Emma Mann: But the truth is that I always just knew deep down that I was going to find some way to serve the Lord. And the mission was the perfect way to do it for me at this point in my life.

Justin Barton: So you're basically, I hope they call me on a mission in primary knowing that I'm gonna go on a mission at that point, huh?

Emma Mann: Yeah.

Justin Barton: Now, you mentioned you have two older brothers, is that what you said?

Emma Mann: Yes.

Justin Barton: And did they both serve a mission?

Emma Mann: Yeah, I have two older brothers and an older sister, and all [00:03:00] three of them serve missions. They're incredible examples to me.

Justin Barton: Let me ask you this, was it kind of an expectation that you would serve a mission, , or did it come from within?

Emma Mann: I would say that it came from within. My parents always were wonderful about supporting us kids and our decisions. They were definitely a spiritual support during our lives, but I never felt.

Emma Mann: They always encouraged me to take ownership of my life and my own decisions. And so when I had my trials of faith and I had my moments when I was trying to figure things out, they told me and encouraged me to go and figure it out, to go ask of God if this was true, to go do the research, to go do this study, to go gain my own testimony of Jesus Christ.

Emma Mann: And so while I'm extremely grateful for the examples of my family, I felt that decision to serve a mission. Was a very personal thing between me and my Heavenly Father. . I very much felt that it was my responsibility to make that decision.

Justin Barton: Super cool. So why don't we jump into one of those trials of faith that your parents were like, sounds tough. Go figure it out. [00:04:00] Go pray about it. Learn about it. You wanna share anything about one of those?

Emma Mann: Yeah. There actually is one that comes to mind, a very specific one. Especially as I was preparing for my mission, I was trying to figure out like one point in my life when I really found out, I knew for myself that Jesus Christ is my savior.

Emma Mann: And that moment honestly came when I was 14 years old and I went through a really challenging experience because when I was 14. I lost a very close friend of mine, and it was a very tragic thing, a very tragic way to lose somebody. And I, for the first time in my life I experienced what it feels like to hit rock bottom, where you're just confused and in the dark and not really sure what kind of good there could be in a world where something like that could happen.

Emma Mann: And I just remember that I had a very. Special experience where I don't know. It was just a very specific day where I could very clearly see two [00:05:00] paths in front of me. One of these paths was that I could just continue feeling the way that I did. I could continue mourning and feeling sad and hurting all the time.

Emma Mann: And the other path was Jesus Christ. And that was the only path that I could imagine leading me to feel joy again and my parents. From the very first day, they were pointing me to Jesus Christ and all that I did, they told me, Emma, choose him. Emma, look to him and he will help you.

Emma Mann: Because even my parents knew that in that situation, Jesus Christ was the only person who really could understand me perfectly and help me perfectly through that situation. And so I decided for the first time in my life that I was really gonna give it a try. I was really gonna try out like having faith in Jesus Christ and telling him exactly how I.

Emma Mann: Felt that's when I started to experience what it means to have a real conversation through prayer. And that's when I started to see miracles in my life. And so I'm just extremely grateful to my parents for guiding me to him. I can [00:06:00] honestly say that Jesus Christ is the person who healed me and helped me to find that true and genuine and lasting joy again.

Emma Mann: And that's why I was so passionate and so excited to remission, because I imagined walking through that experience and not having Jesus Christ to carry me. And I couldn't. I couldn't imagine where I would be right now. I know I wouldn't feel as much joy as I do, and I just wanted to make sure that everybody had that opportunity to be lifted by him.

Emma Mann: Like he lifted me in that situation.

Justin Barton: Wow. That is so powerful and sad. I'm sad that you went through an experience that was so traumatic, but as you look back at it now, it sounds although it's still very sad. It was a hinge point moment that turned you to the savior. How can you look back at that and say, you know what,

Justin Barton: I'm grateful for the experience that I had there.

Emma Mann: I would say I'm immensely grateful for that experience. I think that we need hard experiences to really come to know [00:07:00] Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ became our savior by going through Gethsemane. He had to experience every aspect of the like of the human condition and then go suffer the price of all of our sins.

Emma Mann: He had to take upon himself every single one of our pains. And I think it's a little naive to imagine that we're gonna walk through this life without pain and without suffering, and one day end up like heavenly fathering Jesus Christ. To become like them. We actually have to experience a little bit of Gethsemane in some way or another.

Emma Mann: And I think that I'm just grateful for that experience because that's when I found out for myself that I wasn't, I don't have to do that alone because Jesus Christ already did that. I don't have to experience any of this on my own, and I can trust that he is going to be with me in every moment moving forward.

Emma Mann: And so that little testimony that I gained there when I was 14 is the same testimony like that is what got me through every high and every low, and everything that happened on my mission. I know that he has that perfect understanding of [00:08:00] who we are and when we keep that eternal perspective and trust that this is all for a divine purpose I think it just fills us with hope and joy and that's what carries us through too.

Justin Barton: Beautiful. Thank you for sharing that. I love how you talked about this prayer almost became a conversational thing for you at that point. Kind of define that for me. And for anybody listening, what does that mean, A conversational prayer?

Emma Mann: Okay. I think a conversational prayer comes with the expectation that we're going to receive an answer.

Emma Mann: I think it's really easy to just pray half-heartedly and say, okay, I want this and this I think President Nelson talks about being a, shopping list or like our groceries or whatever and that's not really what I think prayer is designed to be. Our Heavenly Father loves us so much more than we could possibly imagine, and he is so willing to help us.

Emma Mann: We just have to take the time to be still sometimes and look for his voice. So I think to have a conversational prayer all starts with a [00:09:00] true and sincere desire to not only speak to heavenly father, not only ask of him, but also to listen to the counsels that he is willing to give us. And I think when we have that willingness to accept and obey his will, that's when we can start to reach that point of having a conversation with him.

Justin Barton: What does active listening for an answer look like?

Emma Mann: I. Oh man, that is a wonderful question. I think every person receives revelation in a different way, and for me, I even receive revelation in a lot of different ways. I think when I'm trying to have a conversation through prayer, I.

Emma Mann: Need to first off, make sure I'm not rushed, make sure that there's nothing keeping me from receiving these answers. So I try to find a quiet space. I try to create a moment where I'm capable of , feeling the spirit. Sometimes I need to physically like, feel like I'm removing myself from the world and go to the mountains or go to a place, or go to the temple somewhere where I can just feel away from all the other things that might draw my attention away before I'm ready [00:10:00] to receive an answer.

Emma Mann: And I think just as I pray, I. Before I finish my prayer even, , I try to pause and I try to listen, and if the answer doesn't come immediately, which it doesn't, most of the time, I just try to keep looking because I think the Lord is everywhere. He's trying to communicate to us all the time. He's raining down revelation upon us, but sometimes we have an umbrella up and it's hard to hear it, but when you're looking for those answers.

Emma Mann: You'll find them, and I usually find them as I study the scriptures or as I listen to conference talks I receive a lot of revelation, honestly, through other people, or I'll say a very specific prayer. And shortly after somebody will make a comment where I'm like, that is exactly what I know the Lord is trying to tell me right now.

Emma Mann: So I think it just comes from that desire and ongoing search. For the answers.

Justin Barton: . You know, we've been talking here for, I don't know, 15 minutes or so, and we still haven't even started your mission yet.

Emma Mann: Oh, geez.

Justin Barton: So this is really cool. I love setting this foundation here.

Justin Barton: Thanks for walking [00:11:00] me through that. So now let's talk about a time on your mission where you needed to receive Revelation, and maybe it didn't come immediately, but you got the answer. And when you got the answer it was. That is what God is trying to tell me, and now I can take action.

Emma Mann: Oh, that is a wonderful question.

Emma Mann: Okay. There is an experience that comes to mind, and this was when I was about done with my mission actually.

Emma Mann: I was on my second to last transfer, and I don't know if this happens to a lot of people, but I know that from my experience, the adversary works pretty hard to attack missionaries before they go home and make them feel as though they haven't. I learned anything and they haven't changed. They haven't become the person that the Lord had called them to become.

Emma Mann: In that time, I hit a low because I was going through a hard circumstance and I also started to let some of these doubts and lies enter my mind about my worth as not just a missionary, but as a daughter of God. I remember that. [00:12:00] I was trying to be strong in a tricky situation and I was praying, and I was praying and I was praying, just asking for the Lord to help me to have this strength to carry on.

Emma Mann: And then I was asking, I was like I don't know if I was even asking anymore. I was kind of like apologizing for even being a missionary. I was apologizing for even having tried to have served a mission because I felt like I had failed so miserably.

Emma Mann: And that's a pretty low point to get to. Where you're almost done with your mission and , you're almost convinced that it would've been better if you hadn't even gotten it all. And I remember I was at a pretty rock bottom moment, and it happened to be the day of general conference

Emma Mann: I sat down on this general conference and that was a session when our prophet shared his recent talk, where it's called The Lord Jesus Christ, will come again all the doubts that I had, all the worries that I had were answered through that talk.

Emma Mann: But the most important thing that he shared with me that day was that they were going to build a new temple in HoChi then, which is an [00:13:00] area where I had served in my mission. And so immediately, like we all freak out, we go crazy. We're like, oh my goodness, the temple in Hooch Chi. Then this is our dream come true.

Emma Mann: And I just remember that me and my companion, we looked at each other, we knew exactly what we were doing. We ran out of the CRA meeting room, we knelt down. In one of the little side rooms of the chapel on the tile floor, and she told me that I could say the prayer. So I fold my arms and we started to pray and I said this prayer out loud.

Emma Mann: And immediately when we started praying and thanking Heavenly Father for this temple that they're going to build in hoochie 10 we felt the most powerful spiritual confirmation. The Lord knew us and he was proud of the work that we had done, and I don't really know how to describe this moment exactly.

Emma Mann: I just knew that there were angels in that room. Both me and my companion talked afterwards and we felt like the Lord had almost given us a literal hug. It felt as though all the doubts that we were experiencing, especially all the ones that I was carrying at the end of my [00:14:00] mission, they all went away.

Emma Mann: We realized that the Lord was happy with our. Offering to him. And it was just a beautiful moment that I got to share with that companion who I love so much.

Justin Barton: What a beautiful experience. And there were angels in this room, in the zoom room right here as you were sharing that. I was feeling it.

Justin Barton: So thank you for bringing that into my life. Also, what a cool experience , you've mentioned the phrase rock bottom twice now. Talk to me about different experiences that were rock bottoms for you.

Justin Barton: You said at the end of your mission, you said when you were 14 and where God showed up in those places each time that you were there.

Emma Mann: Well,

Emma Mann: that is a really good question. . I think that God showed up, okay. God was always there and absolutely every moment he is here in the good times and the bad times, when I [00:15:00] really was able to recognize and feel in a powerful way that God showed up. It was the moment when I realized that I needed him.

Emma Mann: It was in the moment when I realized that I had nothing else but him to help me through that moment. The Lord is always willing to help us, but it depends on our humility if we're going to have our hearts open enough to receive that help or not. And so when I hit rock bottom, honestly, those were the exact moments that I needed for me to say, okay, I need you.

Emma Mann: Please help me now. And when it came from that sincere point, I think that's when I was able to feel God's power the most strongly in my life. Because , in my mission, for example, I was, I felt alone. I was in a place where like at that point, yes, I spoke the language, but there will always be cultural differences.

You're very far from home, you're very far from your network of people who know and love you, and there is a real feeling of loneliness at times. [00:16:00] But I feel like that moment when I realized that Jesus Christ was the only person who really understood exactly how I felt, who really could help me perfectly with my situation, that's when I was able to see his hand in the strongest way.

Justin Barton: That's really cool. Thank you for sharing that, Emma. How did you recognizing God is always there. I. Help when people that may be friends that you were teaching or members that you were trying to reactivate or, you know, strengthen and they felt like God is not there.

Justin Barton: How were you able to take these experiences that you had with God, that he was always there at the bottom when you needed him most? How were you able to share that with others?

Emma Mann: To be honest, the master teacher is always going to be the Holy Ghost, and I feel like the Holy Ghost speaks through me the best when I testify of Jesus Christ and I testify of his atonement.

Emma Mann: The mission was a remarkable [00:17:00] experience because you get to meet all kinds of broken people, everybody is broken to some extent. That's what it means to be human and. In those moments, I feel like the Lord was able to work through me to comfort his children. Simply as I testified of Jesus Christ, as I testified of the simple truth that He lives, he loves us and he knows exactly what we are going through.

Emma Mann: He suffered so that he could be there for us in every single moment, and because of his atonement, we can have the hope that the vest is always yet to come. That things will get better, that the healing will come at the right time, and that everything that happens is for a purpose. So I think that, with a lot of the people who I met in my mission, a lot of the people who I love, I realized that I had serious limits in helping them as much as I wanted to just solve their problems and make their lives better and make them feel like happy again.

Emma Mann: Hermana Mann couldn't do that, but Jesus Christ could. Jesus Christ can. And so [00:18:00] I just tried. I. The best that a missionary could to direct them to Jesus Christ in every single thing that I did and everything that I said.

Justin Barton: . So Emma, it sounds like you are someone who, at least pretty early on in life realized that I don't got this, I can't do this on my own.

Emma Mann: I don't got this.

Justin Barton: Yeah, , but. The I'm just gonna speak from my perspective growing up and even well into my adult years was, I've gotta be self-reliant. I got this, I have to take care of myself. I have to do this myself. How do you take somebody like me with the perspective that I had for decades and help me realize that it's okay to be broken?

Justin Barton: It's okay. To not have this all by myself.

Emma Mann: Yeah. Can I share a scripture with you?

Please do. Please.

Emma Mann: Okay. There is one that comes to mind, one that kind of [00:19:00] changed my perspective on this. , this is one of my favorite scriptures and it is in second Corinthians 12 verses nine and 10, and it says, and he said unto me, my grace is sufficient for the, for my strength is made perfect in weakness, most gladly. Therefore, will I rather glory in my infirmities. That the power of Christ may rest upon me.

Emma Mann: Therefore, I take pleasure in infirmities and reproaches, and necessities, and persecutions and distress for Christ's sake. For when I am weak, then I am strong. I. I think we need to change our perspective around weakness. We think that weakness is something that makes us less , but I think weakness is what turns us to Jesus Christ.

Emma Mann: Weakness is what helps us to recognize that need that we have for Jesus Christ. It is okay to be weak as long as we choose. [00:20:00] To rely on him. As long as we choose to try to change through the atonement of Jesus Christ, if we have that trust that he can make our weaknesses into strengths, he will. He is a God of miracles, our weaknesses are no match for him.

Emma Mann: And so I think that for somebody who struggles with this concept of weakness, I just think that we all need to try to accept that. That is what draws us to Jesus Christ. He is the master healer. He is the one that can perfect us.

Justin Barton: Absolutely. And you know, I had that awakening. I. Little over a decade ago of It's okay to be broken. It's okay that my weaknesses are a hundred times stronger than I am because like what you said to Jesus Christ my weakest weakness is nothing. It's flip it off the shoulder, I'll take care of it, and, when I finally realized that and owned that, it made all the difference in my life every [00:21:00] difference. So on that note when did you grab hold of that and say it's okay? When did that happen? What experience was that in your life that let you be okay with that?

Emma Mann: I think it's a pretty humbling experience to arrive to a foreign country before you can speak the language or you know anything about the culture.

Emma Mann: You just get dropped there and say, alright, let's go share the gospel. I had no idea what I was doing when I arrived at my mission and not gonna lie, before my mission, I was, I mean, I'm still pretty prideful. I would even dare say that before the mission I was more prideful, which is pretty impressive.

Emma Mann: But I was so humbled when I got to Oaxaca . I can't speak to them like on my own. This is an impossible thing to draw me here and tell me to go invite people to come on to Jesus Christ through faith, repentance, baptism, receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost and endures the end, I was like, this is crazy.

Emma Mann: And. As I worked to learn [00:22:00] the language of the spirit, as I worked to learn Spanish, I saw the power of the gift of tongues, and it was remarkable and I. One experience I can share with you is I remember we were teaching a really fun family, really cool little kid named Javi and his mom is named Olga and she is wonderful.

Emma Mann: So I was just a couple weeks into my mission and I didn't understand what she was saying. I didn't understand the actual words that she was saying 'cause she was speaking Spanish and for some reason in my heart, I just understood what she needed to hear. I understood exactly what God needed to tell her.

Emma Mann: And the words just flowed. I know they weren't mine because they were a lot prettier than anything I could have strung together at that point. And what was interesting is that as soon as we walked outta that house, my Spanish was gone. I couldn't turn and talk to, I wanted tell my companion like, that was so [00:23:00] cool.

Emma Mann: Did you hear that? It didn't come? And I think that was just one of the most beautiful opportunities that Heavenly Father gave me to realize that he doesn't need my capabilities. He doesn't need me to be a perfect missionary or a perfect disciple, or a perfect minister or seminary teacher or whatever I am, and my future calling like he just needs me.

Emma Mann: He needs my heart and he'll make that perfect. He'll make my imperfect offering perfect. And so I think just coming to a new country, learning a new language is just one of the most remarkable ways to learn that lesson, that he'll make my weaknesses become strong as I put my trust in him and seek that spiritual guidance.

Justin Barton: Okay, so you said something that really piqued my interest. You said, as I learned the language of the spirit. Then the Spanish language started to follow is basically what you said. Yeah. Talk to me about the difference between the language of the spirit and how it builds into the gift of tongues,

Emma Mann: I think the [00:24:00] language of the spirit is the ability to

Emma Mann: connect with God. And to feel that love that he has towards other people. The language of the spirit has a lot more to do with love than it has to do with words. It has a lot more to do with what you feel than what you can say. And I felt so close to God, especially in the beginning of my mission to the point where I was able to recognize that.

Emma Mann: I was learning the language of the spirit. I was starting to identify the differences between what kind of worldly things would make me feel and what spiritual things would make me feel. I found that as I studied my scriptures, as I prayed sincerely, as I served others, as I were repented over and over again, that I was starting to feel a peace, a sense of assurance, a sense of love and warmth within me.

Emma Mann: I was [00:25:00] starting to get to know. What it feels like to have the Holy Ghost with you. So I needed to draw as close as I possibly could to Jesus Christ to start to be able to understand that language of the spirit. To start to be able to recognize the difference between just, I don't know, just like normal whatever is going on in my head and what God is guiding me to do.

Emma Mann: I was starting to be able to discern right from wrong , what the decisions I should make in the moment. So I think that was the. Beginning of my journey of starting to understand the language of the spirit. It's something that I'm continuing to work to develop, but I found that as I drew closer to Jesus Christ, the Spanish came.

Emma Mann: As I drew closer to Jesus Christ, the learning came. Even now, I'm not a missionary anymore, but as I draw closer to Jesus Christ, somehow my accounting class is easier. Like it's incredible. But. He does have that power to help us with all things as we are living worthy of having the Holy Ghost with us.

Justin Barton: I love how you brought the [00:26:00] language of the spirit into accounting.

Justin Barton: Something that you'd think what does that have to do with God? What does God have to do with this? But as you are learning that language of the spirit, drawing closer to Christ, even those types of things seem to fall into place and I love that. . Did you have a and maybe we've already touched on this and maybe we've been doing this big time through this conversation, but was there a a verse of scripture that seemed to be thematic throughout your mission that seemed to come back over and over and just define kind of what you were experiencing over the last 18 months?

Emma Mann: There's a scripture that I used to repeat all the time in my head. I love the scripture in second Nephi 22, 2. It says, behold God is my salvation. I will trust and not be afraid for the Lord Jehovah is my strength.

Emma Mann: And my song, he has also become my salvation. And so if there's any theme that was running through my head every moment, all through my mission, it was the words I will trust and not be afraid. [00:27:00] Choosing to trust in Jesus Christ is the most powerful. Powerful tool that, that I could ever ask for. And I knew that because of him.

Emma Mann: I didn't need to be afraid at any moment. I didn't need to be afraid of anything that was gonna be thrown at me during that year and a half of my life. I was just trying every single day of my mission to learn what it means to trust in Jesus Christ.

Justin Barton: And now you've been home a couple months how are you continuing to build that trust and practice that trust in Christ as you continue your walk through life?

Emma Mann: I, in some ways think that me finishing my mission is a greater act of faith than starting it because I just always knew that I was gonna serve a mission. But then coming home, like that's where my life plan ended. I had my whole plan right up until a mission and then nothing. And I. To be honest, I felt like I was walking into the dark and

Emma Mann: I know that Jesus [00:28:00] Christ is coming. I know that means that the best is yet to come. That's the promise that our prophet gave us in his recent general conference talk. But for me, I had a little bit of that fear where I was like, okay, it's the best really yet to come. Mission has been pretty awesome.

Emma Mann: My life's been pretty good. I don't know what's coming next. Like I can't see a clear vision for my life, and so I'm just in this process of learning how to trust that Jesus Christ has a plan for me, even though I'm just taking it like step by step, one step at a time, trying to figure out what his will is for me.

Emma Mann: . I'm finding that it just takes daily trust in Jesus Christ daily trust in Heavenly Father's plan. For me that is perfect. And to keep growing my faith, to keep developing that trust in him. I'm just trying to get to know him better. , I'm trying to get to know him each day as I study the scriptures.

Emma Mann: I try to get to know him as I worship in the temple, as I pray and as I serve and these things are helping me to grow my faith, to [00:29:00] trust a little bit more each and every day that everything's gonna work out just exactly as the Lord has it planned for me.

Justin Barton: Is that kind of a natural, characteristic that you have to be willing to just kinda walk into the dark one step at a time and trust? Or is it kind of frustrating for you, Hey, I wanna see, you know, just show me six months ahead or are you okay with this one day at a time thing?

Emma Mann: Oh, I'm not okay with it. That's why I have only fathers teaching how to do it.

Emma Mann: 'cause this is an important thing for me to learn. I would consider myself obedient. So if heaven father, gave me a little like checklist for my life and a little plan, I'd be like, sweet, I'm sold. Okay, I'll go do it. But he is challenging me to use my agency, which is going to help me grow a lot more and probably become a lot more like Jesus Christ.

Emma Mann: And that is harder for me. That is not natural for me to just trust and take things a step at a time, even though I can't see the full picture quite yet.

Justin Barton: I love how you said this checklist mentality. I am a checklist person. This is my checklist for the day. Every day I have a [00:30:00] checklist at my desk.

Justin Barton: It's what I've gotta do. And checklist versus agency. What does that look like in practice? I've got a checklist. I'm gonna go through it. I've got agency. I need to make choices as I go along and trust God. And either way. I'm trusting God, but I'm more in control here and less in control there.

Justin Barton: How does that look in your life?

Emma Mann: I think

Emma Mann: that I not only have to trust in God, but I also have to, trust that I have a divine identity and divine nature as his daughter, although I'm not like God yet. I already possess God-like attributes simply because I am a daughter of him and I have to trust myself in a way enough to just move forward, make a decision, figure out the next step.

Emma Mann: I trust that God [00:31:00] will make that perfect somehow. Sometimes I'm gonna mess up. I'm actually an expert of that. I mess up all the time. And you know what? You live and you learn. You're repent and you, the Lord will help you to move forward, to change, to grow through every one of those experiences. But I just think that coming to value, the importance of agency

Emma Mann: it's making these decisions easier each day. 'cause I'm recognizing that whether I'm making good decisions or not, like if I'm trying to follow Jesus Christ in all that I do then using my agency in this way is, it's only for my good. I know that the Lord doesn't do anything. Save it be for the benefit of the world.

Emma Mann: No he trusts me to make these decisions. If the Lord sounds quiet, sometimes if I'm not receiving clear revelation or clear answers about what the next steps are that I need to take, that's because the Lord trusts in me to make these decisions.

Emma Mann: He'll help me to refine them. He'll help me to know if I'm on the right path or if I need to get back on the path at some point when I fall off. But I. But yeah, I guess it just comes from recognizing that he [00:32:00] trusted me too. This is a two-way relationship that we have with God.

Emma Mann: It's a mutual . Trust thing. I

love that you mentioned repentance. How has your understanding of practice, of and relationship with repentance evolved over the last handful of years as you've gone through your mission and before that?

Emma Mann: I'm extremely grateful for my mission because that's where I learned that I need repentance just as much as I need air to breathe. Like I need the atonement of Jesus Christ as constantly as I need the air that I breathe. I think that repentance fills us with hope. Repentance is the path to change, and repentance is the way that we can invite the power of Jesus Christ into our lives to change.

Emma Mann: I did not come to this earth to stay the same forever. I came here to change and everybody else did too. And sometimes that change [00:33:00] process is hard, but when we repent, it is possible. We really can become like God. And I just think that it's a joyful process because I felt that joy, I felt godly sorrow. I felt the desire to change.

Emma Mann: I felt the frustration of moving forward, and then I'm like moving backwards and then trying to move forward again. But I know that as we repent, as we use the power of the atonement in our lives, that just leads us to joy because it's leading us to Jesus Christ.

Justin Barton: I talk to a lot of people and , I love talking to people and di diving deeper into having meaningful conversations is how I define it, you know?

Justin Barton: Yeah. And a lot of people, when they think repentance, when they think I've sinned, I've messed up, I've fallen short, they go into . A feeling of shame. You said godly sorrow. How do you differentiate godly sorrow and shame and how do you stay out of the mud and the depths of [00:34:00] that through this repentance process?

Emma Mann: Oh, that is a wonderful question. I think I would say that shame motivates us to turn inwards. It makes us wanna hide from the world. It makes it so we don't wanna be seen. I would say that Godly sorrow motivates us to change, motivates us to turn towards Jesus Christ and keep moving forwards. Satan wants us to feel shame.

Emma Mann: When we mess up, he wants to convince us that there is no way to dig ourselves out of the sins that we've committed. He wants us to feel that shame and hide from these things almost bury our sins. So it's okay, nobody else will ever find them. Not even God. He knows those perfectly. When we're willing to change, when we have that desire, we'll stop feeling shame.

Emma Mann: We'll feel what is called Godly sorrow. Sorrow comes from sin. That sorrow comes from kind of feeling separation from the Holy Ghost because of our sins, but it is something [00:35:00] that has an upward trajectory. I think God cares a lot less about like where we are, the path, and a lot more about our trajectory on the path if we are trying to come unto him.

Emma Mann: It doesn't matter where we are, he's just cheering us on because we're trying to move forward and it will get easier. It'll have its hard moments, it'll have its ups and downs, but if we keep moving forward from that godly sorrow to, really changing, having that desire to change, leaving those sins behind repenting and moving forward in faith that is a process that is joyful, that is hopeful and transformative.

Justin Barton: So the concept of change doesn't scare you anymore or what? Or has it ever scared you? Are you just always someone that's I want to change. I want to grow. I love how you said, I didn't come here to earth to stay the same. I came here to change. Is that how you've always felt?

Emma Mann: Nope. Oh. [00:36:00] I think the natural man doesn't wanna change.

I like to get comfortable where I am and just I dunno, coast through life, but that's not God's plan for us. He created this whole plan of happiness so that we could change constantly, so that we could change to ultimately become well like he is.

Emma Mann: And change is hard. Change is scary. Change is painful at times because you have to admit that you're in the wrong with a lot of things. It's hard to change because it means accepting your own weakness. It's hard to change because it means letting go of your pride and that is not an easy task at all, but it's something that I desire as imperfect as I am at it.

Emma Mann: It is something that I desire because I know that . In my brain, I have my idea of my potential, right? I have my idea. Okay. This is who Emma can become. Now the Lord has his idea of who I can become, and I'm exercising faith that version of myself is so much greater than [00:37:00] anything that I could ever achieve on my own.

Emma Mann: And so that's why I want to change, because I want to see just what Heavenly Father can make of my life. And I want to be able to do his will for me because I believe, and I'm trying every day to believe that it is so much more incredible than anything that would be possible on my own.

Justin Barton: This is amazing.

Justin Barton: Thank you so much, Emma for really going around a subject and just hitting it from a whole lot of different angles. It really helps clarify things for me and for a lot of other people I think. Is there anything on your mind or heart that you're like, man, I really hope Justin asks me about this or that has come in, you've said I gotta share this.

Emma Mann: I would just like to share my testimony of Jesus Christ. I really know that he lives. There is not a day that goes by in my life where I don't see his hand in some ways, in some way, shape or form. I know that he is all over. I know that. My mission was transformative because that's where I got to know [00:38:00] him so much more personally.

Emma Mann: And I know that doesn't have to stop, even though I no longer have a missionary plaque on, and I just wish that every single person could know just how much God loves them. And so I just wanted to testify of Jesus Christ, of his divinity, of his friendship, of the hope that he brings in.

. Emma, the name of this project is, can You Feel? So now, and it's based on Alma chapter five verse 26, and I'm gonna read that, that verse, and then I'm gonna ask you a few questions around that verse.

Justin Barton: . It reads, and now behold, I say unto you, if you have experienced a change of heart, and if you have felt the sing, the song of redeeming love, I would ask, can you feel so now? Tell me about this change of heart that you have experienced over the last couple of years.

Emma Mann: I know that I've experienced a change of heart because my heart is full of gratitude every single day. For Jesus Christ. [00:39:00] And I think that change of heart, it's not a passive thing, it's a very active thing. It's something that we have to decide to experience. If we are willing to search for Jesus Christ, we will find him.

Emma Mann: If we are willing to have our hearts be changed, I know that our hearts will be changed, but it just comes down to our willingness to follow Jesus Christ.

Justin Barton: . So the next part of this, and if you have felt to sing the Song of Redeeming Love, Emma, what does that mean to you to sing the Song of Redeeming Love? And have you sung that song?

Emma Mann: That is so interesting that you ask that today of all the days. I had a really interesting conversation with a friend last night. We're in a religion class together, and our homework last night was to read Psalms and

Emma Mann: he was telling me how much he loved one of the, chapters. He's what did you love about it? I was like, man. I [00:40:00] don't know if I love Psalms right now. I don't know if I can sing that right now. And as I was sitting in class today, as we were viewing Psalms and as we were listening to music from the Tabernacle Choir, and as we were talking about this idea of, just emotion, I guess, or the feeling that goes into creating these psalms. It just, it made me actually start to ask myself very sincerely if I could praise the Lord through song right now. I think there are times in my life when I could say that I have definitely felt that. I'm not gonna lie.

Emma Mann: The revelation that I received today is that I need to focus more on Jesus Christ to be able to feel that again, to be able to really sing, to be able to really praise the Lord in that way. And so in my life I have had very personal experiences with the Lord, where I have known how he's real, that I know that it's an ongoing [00:41:00] thing.

Emma Mann: Just because I felt in the past doesn't mean that. I can just carry that with me forever. No testimonies aren't meant to be put on shelves. And so the truth is that I'm still in this process and it's still something that I need to search out every day, but especially today, the Lord decided to confirm to me that I need to keep looking.

Emma Mann: I need to keep searching until I can get to that point where I can sing and praise the Lord with my whole soul.

Justin Barton: How beautiful is that? That. This coincidence of this questioning and of this music happened, right? The God incidents. Thank you for being vulnerable in that and being willing to share that.

Justin Barton: Okay, so this last part of this verse, the question is, can you feel, so now, and what I want to do is jump in a time machine with you, you and I were gonna go ahead 20 years from now, we're gonna step outta this time machine and you're gonna see yourself 20 years from now and yourself

Justin Barton: [00:42:00] emma, is struggling, is having a hard time, isn't feeling so now. What would you like to say to yourself at that point and invite yourself to remember to come back and feel so again.

Emma Mann: I think I would just invite myself to

Emma Mann: look for Jesus Christ and hold onto that. If I have any little bit of a testimony of Jesus Christ left, I'll say hold onto that like it is the only thing that you have in the world to hold onto. I would tell myself to kneel down and no matter how hard it is, no matter how low of a low I'm at, I would say to just go talk to him.

Emma Mann: Go share exactly what I'm feeling. And I would tell my future self that right now I know that he lives. I know that it's all true, and I know that if he can [00:43:00] save me right now in my life, he can save me in 20 years. He can save me every single day because he has my savior. He loves me so much that he's willing to help me in every single moment.

Justin Barton: . My last invitation to you in this conversation, would you be willing to bear testimony in Spanish about the savior?

Justin Barton: Amen. Amen. Thank you so much, Emma. This has been so meaningful for me. I hope it's been meaningful for you also.

Emma Mann: Yeah. Thank you so much.