Cameron Hales

Justin Barton: . [00:00:00] I am Justin Barton and grateful and spoiled rotten to be the host of the Can You Feel So Now? podcast in which I get to speak with Freshly returned missionaries of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints and just get to dive into questions that they typically wouldn't answer on a day-to-day basis from people asking them about their missions.

Justin Barton: And I, I find a lot of meaning in this and I hope that those I speak with do also today I am here with Cameron Hales and this is somebody I've never met in person before and I'm really excited to get to know a little bit more about you, Cameron.

Justin Barton: So tell me a little bit about you, where you're from some of your hobbies. A little bit about your family maybe.

Cameron Hales: Yeah. , Cameron Hales is my name. I'm from California. That's where I'm calling out of today. My hobbies I played rugby all throughout high school.

Cameron Hales: And so I really love playing rugby. I love sports. It's always, sports have always been a part of my life. I love cars. I love working on cars and driving them. I love racing. And so that's a big part of my life too. I watch a lot of [00:01:00] Formula One so I'm familiar at all with that.

Cameron Hales: And I served my mission in Washington. So I went to the Vancouver Washington Mission. It covers like the southwestern corner of the state.

Justin Barton: Very cool. So you served in the Vancouver Washington mission. So I'm in the northeast part of the state in Spokane. And you served in Vancouver. Previously you said you're from California and loved rugby, sports cars growing up.

Justin Barton: Let's talk about rugby. How did your love of play of and understanding of the sport of rugby maybe help you in your mission?

Cameron Hales: That's an interesting question. I've never actually, I've never tried to make a connection between rugby and my mission. Rugby's a pretty rough sport if you're unfamiliar with the sport. It's rough. People equate it to football without pads. It's a little different. But if you're just trying to imagine it for the first time, it's kinda like football without pads.

Cameron Hales: And so there's a lot of physical contact. You're running a lot. Unlike football, when somebody gets tackled, the play doesn't die. And so like soccer, you're always [00:02:00] running around, like it's pretty constant. I remember there would be some times on the field where we're 70 minutes into the game and just exhausted.

Cameron Hales: Pretty done, not really wanting to continue. Maybe we were up, maybe we were down. But either way I was done, and that was looking back on it. Now it's a mediocre thought. Oh it's difficult. I don't really care where the score's at. I'm just done, like , if the game ended right now, I'd be okay.

Cameron Hales: And so I guess to, to equate that to my mission, there were times on my mission where it would get difficult and I would be okay if it ended, but. Just like the rugby games, obviously it wasn't going to, and so

Cameron Hales: those rugby games where I was ready for it to just be over, but I still continued to play. I still gave it my best because I owed it to my teammates. I owed it to my coach who spent the time [00:03:00] to coach us. And I continued to play and I finished the game and gave it everything.

Cameron Hales: Just like my mission, those times where I was ready for it to be done, I was ready for it to be over. It was hard. I was finished. Still giving it everything you have is, and we're talking about a mission. It's way more important than a rugby game, right? And so still giving it everything you have is important.

Cameron Hales: And so I guess you could say I learned a little bit of that long suffering from rugby

Justin Barton: yeah. I love that. And why don't you give me an example of a time in your mission where, apathy came in the mediocre thought of I don't care if this ended right now, I would be okay.

Justin Barton: But I'm gonna continue to press forward and finish this game, finish this mission.

Cameron Hales: Yeah. So the first one that comes to mind was actually towards, is the last transfer of my mission. And so the end was already in sight. I tried not to think about it.

Cameron Hales: But I was on an exchange and I was with these two elders. So we're in a trio and if anybody listening, if you haven't ever been to Washington it rains. [00:04:00] The winter is rain. The end of my mission was. Like October, December, like that was kinda the last chunk of my mission.

Cameron Hales: And I was on this exchange, it was raining a lot. And we were knocking doors. That was our whole night that we had planned was just to track. And I remember it was like six 30. We've got about an hour and a half to go. And. I was soaked from, head to toe we get back in the car to go to a new section of houses, and I was just like, wow, this sucks.

Cameron Hales: What am I doing here? What am I doing? And at that point if we were like, man, this really is terrible, let's go find something else to do.

Cameron Hales: So we, my point is we could have found other things to be doing but for the whole night, we tracked it in the rain. I, and did anything miraculous come from it? No, not really. But [00:05:00] now I have that experience. I've had that kind of a moment. Where I can say, yeah, that was pretty terrible.

Cameron Hales: The people that night weren't particularly nice either. And the winter in Washington, the sun sets it like. , it gets dark at like four or four 30. And so as people are confused why you're knocking on their door at 6 37, 7 30 and so I learned how to just push through it.

Cameron Hales: I was wet, I was cold, it was windy, didn't really wanna be there. Other things we could have been doing, but we continued. And now I can say that I've done that and I've learned the importance of just pushing through.

Justin Barton: Yeah. So as you look at that lesson there, the importance of pushing through, , how do you think that can benefit you, in the next phase of your life, whether it be school, whether it be profession, whatever that looks like, how can that benefit you,

Cameron Hales: that's a good question. I think to start with school. School isn't my favorite thing in the world. I didn't do particularly good in high school, [00:06:00] and sitting down and just studying or doing a whole bunch of homework for a long period of time is hard for me.

Cameron Hales: So I think ha, having gone on a mission and having had some of those experiences of just having to put your head down and grind a little bit will be helpful because now when I'm sitting down at the table to do homework or to study for a long time I can say, well, I've I did it with a mission.

Cameron Hales: . I did it in the rain, I did it when people were. Mean yelling at us. I can do it at a table when I'm dry and warm for a little bit. And so I think as far as schooling and stuff, that'll help. 'cause that was really a struggle for me. It was just taking the time to study and do homework and stuff.

Cameron Hales: And as far as the profession goes, I think it'll be helpful , I've got limited experience in the professional world when it comes to having a career. But I think that there's times where like a job can get stressful, right? Maybe you've got a superior [00:07:00] who's not, your favorite person on in the world, maybe got coworkers who aren't favorite people in the world.

Cameron Hales: Being able to just. Look at the task at hand, even though I gotta deal with a superior. I don't like and coworkers, I don't like very much. But through all of that, well, it won't last forever. That's what I'd tell myself on my mission it won't last forever.

Cameron Hales: It'll be done eventually and I just have to give it my all until that point. In a career from a professional standpoint, doing that same thing yeah, I gotta work with these people, or maybe this task is hard, but if I just give it everything and then number one, it's not gonna last forever and we'll get it done.

Justin Barton: Yeah. I really like that phrase that you just said there. It won't last forever. And I think that's something that could help me. Yes, in those hard times, but even in the good times of. Man, life is amazing right now. It won't last forever, so I'm gonna enjoy it while it's here because there's sure to be a down spot on that.

Justin Barton: Were there times on your mission where the highs were just so high and you're like, I don't want this to ever end, and [00:08:00] then, you hit another trial or low spot?

Cameron Hales: Yeah. There were definitely times on my mission where I didn't want it to ever end. Those were those times were particularly towards the end of my mission.

Cameron Hales: Because that's when you realize that things have to come to an end. When you're at 18 months and you only got six months left, which is a long time, but you only have a certain amount of time left and you're like, oh, dang So there were plenty of times. I remember we were at our friends this guy we were teaching, his name was Michael. And he was the most, he's the most genuine person I've ever met, and he is, had a lot of struggles in his life.

Cameron Hales: He hasn't had an easy life by any measure but he was the most genuine guy. I think he was 26 or 27. I had said goodbye to him for the last time I was leaving the area. And went over, said bye, gave him some motivation. , And I got back in the car and I was like, dang.

Cameron Hales: I told my companions I was in a trio at the time. I was like, I don't want this to end. And they're like, whoa. Like with Michael, I was like, [00:09:00] no, like a mission. Just because every time we went over to Michael's, he was so genuine. We always had a good conversation. The lessons were always great and so it was just hard at that time.

Cameron Hales: That's when I really realized like, dang, like this won't last forever. And so , like you were just saying it's the exact opposite. Oh, hard time. It won't last forever. I can get through it. And then you switch over to the really good times where dang, this isn't gonna last forever.

Cameron Hales: I don't really want it to end. And so really cherishing those moments. And I luckily, I realized when I had that kind of first dang, this is gonna end. Eventually, when I had that first one where I didn't really want it to I, I knew that I just had to cherish every single moment after that.

Justin Barton: Yeah I think you shared something there that, at least for me is really powerful. So I want to ask you about this. You mentioned that your friend had a really rough life. , By any measure,

Justin Barton: what did that teach you? By interacting with people like him and maybe others who had a really [00:10:00] rough life. Rough life, whether it be by circumstances outside of their control or their own making of making a rough life and falling on their face over and over again. What did that teach you about compassion for others who may not have it as you have had it and experienced in your life?

Cameron Hales: Seeing people who, whether by their own decisions or like you said, circumstances they can't control who have it. Just rough seeing those people.

Cameron Hales: It always made me feel a little.

Cameron Hales: Well, it was humbling. I'll say that. It was very humbling because you've got these, let's take Michael for example. He's, like I said, super rough life, super happy guy. He was always happy and it made me feel like, wow, I have I have no room in my life to complain about anything, and it taught me compassion because.

Cameron Hales: Actually I learned compassion from [00:11:00] Michael. Because he had everything to complain about, and he just, he didn't, he, and he showed compassion towards everything. Like this guy, he had a big walnut tree in his backyard and he would just there was squirrels in it all the time and he would just like talk to the squirrels.

Cameron Hales: , But this guy, he was just so compassionate towards everything in his life and that to hopefully answer your question, that made me realize that I was like, dang, I gotta. Step it up, like maybe I can be a little gruff sometimes or a little rough.

Cameron Hales: And I just need to show a little bit more love towards everything in my life, even though maybe it's raining, maybe I'm cold and I'm wet. It shouldn't matter. I should just be showing love towards everything. Because you have Michael here and he's showing love to the squirrels in his walnut tree, right?

Cameron Hales: I could be doing a little bit better about people around me, the [00:12:00] missionaries interact with.

Justin Barton: Yeah. That kind of takes me to passage in the Sermon on the Mount where Christ says, in essence , consider the sparrows. They aren't worried about things. And if a single Sparrow falls, father knows about it, God knows about it.

Justin Barton: How much more are you than the sparrows? So he knows all of our troubles. Did you have any experiences in your mission where you're like, oh, dang, God knows this little trouble that I'm having and is carrying me through it, even though it doesn't seem like it should be that important to him?

Cameron Hales: Yeah. So I was in Washington and it was just a stressful time toward the end of my time there. It was pretty stressful. I had a lot going on and I was aware of this scripture. My whole mission

Cameron Hales: It's a very popular scripture, everyone. I'm sure if you're listening you've heard it, it's first E 5 3 7. To get a little context, Lehigh asks his sons to, get the plates of brass from Lavin and Nephi's [00:13:00] brothers do their murmuring. Nephi's response is this.

Cameron Hales: And he said, and it came to pass that I said unto my father, I will go and do the things which the Lord has commanded for. I know that the Lord gave with no commandments until the children of men safely shall prepare a way for them that they may accomplish the thing which he commands them. And at this particular time in my mission, that stuck out to me because I had a lot of things going on.

Cameron Hales: I was stressed out. There was just a lot going on and I read that and to, to me, not to change the wording of the scripture, but to maybe make it more applicable. Switch the word commandment with like trial or hardship or task. He doesn't give any of these things to us unless he prepares away a, for us to do it and that we can accomplish it. And so in Centralia, during the stressful time. I had a lot of stuff on my plate.

Cameron Hales: None of it was super monumental. It was just the fact that there was a lot of it that was [00:14:00] stressing me out. And so God could've taken zero notice to it, and it wouldn't have really probably affected much. But instead that's, that scripture stuck out to me, and I know that it was the spirit that really said that You need to pay attention to this particular scripture right here.

Cameron Hales: Instead he. He gave that to me and it helped. I was able to take a step back from everything after, weeks of stressing out and tweaking a little bit. I was able to take a step back and realized that it's not really in my hands.

Justin Barton: Yeah, so, . In that time when you realized, hey, it's not really in my hands. , How did God provide a way, there's no commandment, no trial, no whatever situation that God gives except he prepares a way for them that they shall accomplish the thing.

Justin Barton: How is that way prepared for you, Cameron, that you could accomplish or move through that trial?

Cameron Hales: Because. Of that scripture, I realized , [00:15:00] that there isn't anything that God hasn't prepared a away for. And so what I didn't wanna do was take too far of a step back and say, okay, I'm just gonna let it all go and God will take care of it.

Cameron Hales: That's not quite how it works. We still have to put an effort. We still have to keep going. But what made the difference was trusting that. If I was doing what I was supposed to be doing, if I was working hard and trying God would just lead my footsteps. And so it was like a blind walk into whatever it was, and trusting that if I was doing my best to follow the spirit, that it would work out.

Cameron Hales: And so it wasn't like I was sitting at my desk and everything just clicked. I had this big aha moment. It was just I'll do my best. Trust that if there's any hiccups in my own thought process or in anything that I'm gonna do, that God will clean it up a little bit. It kinda reminds me of that scene from Indiana Jones where he is looking at the bridge, the invisible bridge, and he throws the sand on it.

Cameron Hales: It's kinda one of those things like I just gotta keep going and trust that there's gonna be a bridge underneath that. That [00:16:00] God will put. A foot stool under me and I can go,

Justin Barton: yeah, I love that imagery and that scene from that movie. In fact I've used that before in my life where I felt like I was there at the edge and I took the step and I was like, okay, God, if this is gonna happen, you're gonna have to catch me.

Justin Barton: I didn't feel the bridge until it was, you know when you step off something and it's a couple inches further than you thought it was, and it feels like you're falling forever before your foot hits. Yeah. I've had those types of experiences where it's oh, I've fallen and then my foot hits.

Justin Barton: Does that, can you identify with that?

Cameron Hales: Yeah, that's really that's good. Yeah, and even

Justin Barton: though it's only a couple of inches, it sure feels like it's a longer fall than you think.

Cameron Hales: Because you're ki you're

Cameron Hales: Hoping that it'll be right there level with the ground you're on.

Cameron Hales: But no, I know what you're saying. Yeah. No, I really like that. That's cool.

Justin Barton: Good. All right. So you brought up first Nephi three, seven. Is there another verse or [00:17:00] passage of scripture that seemed to be a theme throughout your mission that seemed to come back over and over again as you served?

Cameron Hales: One that I shared a lot with people, especially when teaching about prayer was the book of Enos just because it's such a powerful. Book about prayer, and we don't want to, sit here and read the whole book. But Enos in this book has an experience with prayer and repentance.

Cameron Hales: And to me it always highlighted how powerful prayer can be in our lives if we utilize the tool, right? Prayer is a tool, it's a gift. So if we fully utilize that tool, that gift that we've been giving of prayer,

Cameron Hales: It can be so powerful and I try to teach people that, and help people understand that through the book of Enos. And. What really stuck out to me was he talks about in verse four, and he says, in my soul, hungered, which I think is pretty interesting verbiage, [00:18:00] my soul hungered.

, As far as I'm aware, it's not something that we read too much in the scriptures about somebody's soul hungering. And I'd always ask people if they feel like their soul. Was hungering for anything. And so to answer your question, this whole passage came up quite a bit as I taught about prayer and how powerful it was.

Cameron Hales: 'cause you have this man here whose soul is hungering and then verse two, he talks about the wrestle he had before God. So just to make it chronological he's telling us about the wrestle that he had before God and how he received a remission of his sins. His soul is hungering and he prays and he says, and I cried unto him, mightily in prayer and supplication for my own soul

Cameron Hales: and all the day long did I grind him. So he's praying for a long time. And in verse five. We continue that, that he was forgiven. But the two most important things that I would highlight to people were that his soul was hungering. And so he had a real desire. And [00:19:00] in verse seven and eight, so we have Enos here who shows hungering.

Cameron Hales: He has. He's identified, right? Maybe a problem. He's I need to fix this in my life. And so he turns to prayer in verse seven and eight. He ask the Lord, how's it done? And the Lord responds, and it's because of his faith. And so that's what I would highlight to people like you. You need your, you, your soul needs to hunger.

Cameron Hales: You need to have a genuine desire for something, whether it's for knowledge or forgiveness, whatever it is, your soul needs to be hungry. So you really need to want something. And then have the faith like Enos to

Justin Barton: pray. Thank you for sharing that. And, something I've observed in my own life and in having conversations like this, oftentimes when a passage of scripture rings out and it becomes a focal point where I share it with a lot of other people, at some point it was a real weak spot in my own life.

Justin Barton: How has your own prayer life and process evolved over the years and throughout your [00:20:00] mission?

Cameron Hales: So before my mission prayer was like, well, see, I wasn't praying that much, honestly.

Cameron Hales: Really, the only times that I would pray would be with my family, whether it was like at a meal or like evening prayer before bed.

Cameron Hales: But I didn't pray very much on my own and

Cameron Hales: towards the beginning of my mission. I think it was in my training. So my first two transfers we had shared the scripture with somebody that we were teaching. And it made me realize. My prayer game was a little off because you have Enos here who's soul is hunger for something, and he wrestles with the Lord and he prays for what he says.

Cameron Hales: All the day long. I'm off. I'm off from that, right? , I can't compete with that. And so it made me realize that I needed to step up my game when it came to prayer. And very luckily for me, I had just the best mission president I could have ever asked for.

Cameron Hales: He was a very influential man in my life and [00:21:00] personal prayer of his missionaries and the quality of the personal prayer of the missionaries that he served was very important to him. And so it was a big point that he made all the time. He was always trying to figure out how we can improve prayer and how we can.

Cameron Hales: Make it more valuable and meaningful. And so in combination with sharing this scripture, sharing other scriptures about prayer, and my admission president who was monumental in this, my prayers went from not really even happening to really meaningful. I looked forward to it especially at the end of the day.

Cameron Hales: I looked forward to prayer and , they were more sincere. There was more of a. More of a conversation than just like writing a quick letter off and setting it off. It was more of a conversation because not only did my end of the prayer become more developed, but , my receiving end.

Cameron Hales: I now I know how to get a prayer answer. It sounds weird. It's oh, well you. You should know how a prayer [00:22:00] gets answered, but at least for me, I learned a lot about how God answers my prayers and what I should be doing if I really want an answer.

Cameron Hales: So that, if you can imagine kind of that prayer progression, that's kind how it looked by the time the end of my mission came my prayers mean a lot to me. They do

Justin Barton: I love that. And I was actually going to go there because in this passage you read and I said, Lord, how is it done?

Justin Barton: And the Lord answered him. So I was gonna ask you, how does the Lord answer you? And you said, Hey, it's a two-way conversation. So how does the Lord speak to you, Cameron?

Cameron Hales: A lot of the time for me,

Cameron Hales: I get a prayer answered. And like the understand. How am I trying to say this? The way that I can understand it. How well I can understand the answer to my prayer is pretty directly linked to how much time I spend in the scriptures now. I'm not saying that I get my answer from the scriptures all the time because sometimes I do, [00:23:00] sometimes I'm reading it like, oh, that.

Cameron Hales: If something sticks out and it makes sense, and I can kinda link it to a, maybe a question I've had but the amount of time that I spend in the scriptures is almost like directly proportional to how well, or how well I can understand the answer to a prayer. If it's not in the scriptures, what it looks like a thought or a feeling.

Cameron Hales: It goes back to what I was saying about moving forward and faith maybe a little bit blind. If I have a question and I ask God, and maybe it's about

Cameron Hales: To give an example maybe about work and. I don't really know if I should take this job or this job. I ask God and maybe, I'm not gonna read the scriptures that Cameron, you should take, you should take Job A, but if I continue and I do what I'm supposed to do, and I do my best with my prayer and my scriptures and I try and be a good [00:24:00] boy.

Cameron Hales: That I'll just, that's the direction that life will take me. And so sometimes to answer your question a little bit more directly, sometimes I get my answer to prayer through the scriptures by what I read, and sometimes it's just by having faith and moving forward. And that's just the direction that my path has taken.

Justin Barton: Yeah. So, you learned over the last couple of years of being a missionary that answers to prayers are directly correlated to the amount of time you're spending in the scriptures. Your prayers are more of a two-way conversation .

Justin Barton: How have you maintained that since you got home from your mission in the last couple of months? And are there changes that need to be made or are you going along pretty well still?

Cameron Hales: No, there's definitely changes that need to be made. So when you're getting towards the end of your mission, you get warnings from your mission president, from his wife, from the other mission leaders about how hard it is to stay.

Cameron Hales: Focused when you get home. And I was like, yeah, whatever. [00:25:00] No, it's not because I, in my mind, I've made all of these wonderful changes. I've changed so much and there's no way I could deviate right, wrong. It's pretty hard to keep those habits.

Cameron Hales: And so my prayers, they are meaningful. Now do I need to make them more consistent? Yes, I do. I need to pray more consistently, more throughout the day, not rather than just like the box check right, at the end of the day. But just, as a missionary, you pray. I can't even count how many times you prayed in lessons.

Cameron Hales: I had a lot of meetings. You pray in meetings, you pray before you leave your apartment, you pray before each meal, you pray a lot. And I'm just not doing that. And so to maintain that level of commitment and focus, i'd say the most important part is building a habit, but that's not enough.

Cameron Hales: You need some sort of system. I don't really have a system in like a solid system in place to help me maintain it. 'Cause you just, you think, oh, I'll just remind myself I'll just remember and that [00:26:00] doesn't happen either.

Cameron Hales: And so that's something I need to figure out. . This is good that we're having this conversation 'cause it's helping me realize.

Justin Barton: Yeah, and that's honestly a major motivation , behind this project is to help you and help me remember in that whole process of what worked for me.

Justin Barton: What helped me be that connected to God and what do I need to do to continue that connection now? Life moves on. Things get busy in school, things get busy in work, things get busy in family as we continue to walk down this path of life. But I hope to learn from you and others like you, and I hope to remind you and others like you that

Justin Barton: time with God is more important than everything. So with all of these different things that we've learned here, part of that process I think is to remember that the Lord makes all things possible. Like what you said in one Nephi three, seven, if there's something put in front of me, he'll provide a way to get through it, but I need to ask him and rely on him to [00:27:00] do that.

Justin Barton: So is there anything else on that, that you'd like to maybe teach me or expound upon?

Cameron Hales: I don't know. So , it was a lot harder to take a step forward in faith than I thought it would be. And so for anyone maybe at that point, they're like, yeah, I need to just take a step forward in faith and rely and trust that he'll put a path for me.

Cameron Hales: I'd honestly say the best way to gain trust for the Lord that he will put a path in front of you is to read the scriptures, because all throughout the scriptures. That's in part what the scriptures are. You're reading a whole bunch of people who are in tough situations and they're just asking for a path and we can read that.

Cameron Hales: He puts one in front of him that's pretty consistent. God consistently puts paths in front of people. We have Nephi who his brothers tried to kill him on multiple occasions. His dad lose faith in him [00:28:00] and in the Lord. And on multiple occasions, Nephi was able to, because he was faithful and he continued, he was able to get outta those sticky situations he was able to provide for his family.

Cameron Hales: And so. My biggest piece of advice, I guess , is to gain trust for the Lord by reading the scriptures, because that's all we read about is Him putting paths in front of people.

Justin Barton: Yeah, and I love that in the scriptures, very few of those examples that the Lord puts a path in front of our. Quote unquote perfect people.

Justin Barton: They're people with messes in their lives. How does that bring you, Cameron, , hope that even if I'm a mess, friends who, like you talked about Michael earlier, there's a path there. It's a hard path, but there's a path there. How does that bring you hope in your life?

Justin Barton: That the Lord will always take care of you no matter what.

Cameron Hales: Well, it brings me hope because I, like I've said he did it for these people to take take Enos for example. Another [00:29:00] one Enos, I think . He wasn't like the best guy, he had some, maybe some skeletons in his closet, maybe literal, and he realized that there needed to be changes or we take Michael for example, who just had a really hard path. The similarity between Enos and Michael is that they wanted change.

Cameron Hales: And I think. For anyone who's in that position, an imperfect person who's trying to do the will of the Lord, is that they want change. Do I want change in my life? Yeah. I'm sure you probably want some things to change in your life. Enos did. Michael did so I, I trust that the Lord will take me an imperfect person and still provide me a path.

Cameron Hales: Even though I have struggles, I'm imperfect because I want to change, and we can take take Nephi, let's hypothetically say that Nephi pretty righteous person, right? He [00:30:00] did some good things. Let's say he didn't really wanna change. He's yeah, I'm good where I'm at.

Cameron Hales: We wouldn't have a whole lot of the scriptures if that's the way Nephi was, because Nephi was always looking to improve and looking to do the will of the Lord. That's the reason he was successful. So I think like Enos, like Michael like anyone, if we have the desire to change and to do better, then we can trust that the Lord will provide for us.

Justin Barton: Yeah. I love that. . How has your relationship with Jesus Christ evolved over the last few years?

Cameron Hales: Yeah,

Justin Barton: that's

Cameron Hales: a good question. Loaded

Cameron Hales: well, not to be repetitive, but I'd say the biggest factor was prayer and how much it did develop. But also equally as important is my understanding of the atonement. I gained over the course of my mission. I didn't really understand the atonement before my mission. I knew what it was. And I knew that it was important, [00:31:00] but I didn't really understand it and I don't say that I understand it now. I don't know if we can ever truly comprehend.

Cameron Hales: Magnitude, but we can understand it as a concept. And I do, I understand it as a concept now and how monumental it is in my life, because I'd be totally done without it, right? We all would. My relationship with Christ has improved because over the course of my mission, I.

Cameron Hales: Gained a better understanding of what he did . Personally for me, I gained a huge appreciation, obviously I loved my parents before my mission. Of course I did, but I gained a huge appreciation for everything they've done for me over the course of my mission.

Cameron Hales: 'cause I grew up a little bit and I saw the sacrifices that they made for me. That improved our relationship similarly to the atonement. I have grasped a little bit better more the sacrifices that Christ has made for me and. [00:32:00] Because of that, I feel like I understand him better. I know him better, and that has improved our relationship.

Justin Barton: I love that walkthrough.

Justin Barton: The understanding of him better has helped that relationship grow more. And I think like what you said earlier. This is a process that I can continue my entire life and never arrive at perfection. I can be continually growing. Good. So before we start wrapping this up Cameron, do you have any other things that are sitting on your heart that you're like, I really feel the need to share this before we start going into closeup questions?

Cameron Hales: I hope that if somebody's listening that hasn't decided whether or not to serve a mission when I talk about my mission, I talk about how hard it was on . My homecoming talked about how hard it was. And how much it sucked.

Cameron Hales: And I've talked at [00:33:00] like mission prep classes and other kind of spinoff classes and talked about how hard it was. I love talking about the difficulty of a mission because the fact that it was so difficult, but that I'm standing here and I did two years.

Cameron Hales: Is a testament to how much it can change a person. And so my homecoming talk, the missionary prep classes, every time I talk about my mission, I talk about how hard it was for me because I love highlighting the changes and the difficulties brought in my own life. And so if you're listening, you're like, wow, this guy just talked about how much it sucked and not really making me want to go.

Cameron Hales: It was difficult, but if you're on the fence. About going or maybe you're home and you're on the fence about staying in the church.

Cameron Hales: My mission has brought me more change in my life than anything else will, and I know that's because of how hard it was and because through the [00:34:00] difficult times I decided to make those changing points in my life because I did that. Because the Lord is so merciful I've changed into a much better person.

Cameron Hales: All the hard times, all the long suffering was worth it.

Justin Barton: I. I love that. And you brought that right back to what you talked about with rugby. The game's almost over. I'm exhausted. I don't care if it's over or not, but I'm gonna push through for my teammates, for my coach, , I'm gonna push through four. Them. And I love how you brought that around there, so thank you for sharing that, Cameron. Alright. As I mentioned earlier, and as you know I do, at the end of all of these this project is entitled Can You Feel So Now, and it's based on Alma chapter five verse 26, which reads, and now behold, I say unto you, if you have experienced a change of heart and if you have felt to sing the Song of Redeeming Love, can you feel so now, talk to me a little bit about a change of heart. What does that mean and look like to [00:35:00] you from your mission? Cameron? Change of heart.

Cameron Hales: Just my desires in life. Before my mission, my focuses were. I honestly don't know what they were.

Cameron Hales: I didn't like, I didn't have whole much of a life performing mission. But the change of heart that I've experienced looks like, it took it from whatever it was performing mission, and now I'm a much more dedicated disciple. And I want to be, and I think that's the biggest thing is the desire.

Cameron Hales: And so it's been very rewarding actually to see the change, to see that juxtaposition. Before my mission I . Like I wasn't praying, I wasn't really reading scriptures to now where I understand the importance and I want it in my life.

Cameron Hales: I think that's the biggest. Differences. It's changed my desires.

Justin Barton: I think that's a [00:36:00] fantastic definition of a change of heart. All right, the next phrase, if you have felt to sing, the Song of Redeeming love, what the heck does that mean in your life,

Cameron Hales: Well, I would say it to me, when I think of like the Song of Redeeming Love, I think of the Atonement. So I have felt that in my life I've felt forgiveness and I've felt change. So, I think just to answer your question, I think that's what it would mean is probably just the feelings of God's love and the feelings of Christ's love and of the atonement.

Justin Barton: All right. Now with this last part of the question, which is actually the question mark, can you feel, so now what I want to do with you is I want to jump in a time machine. Let's jump ahead about 15 years. And you and I get outta the time machine when we run across you.

Justin Barton: You are, wherever you are in 15 years, maybe a family work, whatever you're doing, and you are in a moment of your life like. It's 70 minutes into the rugby game where you're like this is hard. This sucks. . It can be over right now for all I care, and you're just not [00:37:00] feeling it. Why don't you get out there and coach yourself up and remind yourself how you feel today to try and remind that person 15 years from now to feel so now.

Cameron Hales: . I'd say,

Cameron Hales: dude, you've, you've gone through this before. Maybe it's a little different, maybe. Yeah. Now . You have a wife, you've got kids, you have a career, and you got more on your plate. But. You've gone through it before.

Cameron Hales: If I'm talking to myself, this is probably what I'm saying, fundamentally, how is it any different? It's the same thing, you've got, you've different trials, but it's the same concept for any instance in the scriptures. What I love about the scriptures is how consistent they are for any trial that anybody goes through in the scriptures.

Cameron Hales: What is almost always the solution? It's just to be faithful. Do what you're supposed to do, trust in the Lord, pray, read the scriptures. If you can do all of those things [00:38:00] and just do your best, just put your foot forward. Yeah. You've got a harder life now and things are different, but just put your foot forward.

Cameron Hales: Put your head down and your foot forward, and if you're doing what you're supposed to do, your foot will land.

Justin Barton: Love that. Put your head down and your foot forward. I got goosebumps 'cause you were coaching me up there. I hit those points too, where it's like today can be over for all I care. Yeah. I'm not feeling it. Put your head down your foot forward, just finish up. I love this.

Justin Barton: . All right, Cameron, before we close out now, if you're willing, I'd love to hear your testimony of some of the things that you find most important in the gospel.

Cameron Hales: Yeah. So first of all, I know that Christ lives that he's a real , a lot of the time we talk about God and Christ as and because we're talking about 'em on such a high plane, it can seem like [00:39:00] they're.

Cameron Hales: He's obscure beings. No. Christ is real. Like he's a real person. And I know that he lives and that he performed that atonement because he loves each and every one of us. And I know that

Cameron Hales: we have what we need in this life to get back to him. We have something we didn't talk a whole lot about today. We have a modern day prophet who is God's mouthpiece to the whole world. How much of a gift is that? We have the scriptures. So I know that Russell M. Nelson, that he is a true prophet that he is God's mouthpiece.

Cameron Hales: And I know, like we've talked a lot about today, if we do our best, like Elder Bednar says if we're just a good boy or a good girl and we're doing what we're supposed to be doing and we put our head down and our foot forward that it'll land and maybe it doesn't land immediately.

Cameron Hales: Sometimes I know people have had experiences in life where they're like, I'm doing what I'm supposed to do, and I'm taking a step in faith and I feel like I'm still falling. [00:40:00] Well, maybe sometimes, there's a gap between where we're at and the ledge that God has put for us and we need to fall a little bit.

Cameron Hales: And so I know that there's always a path for us, and I know that the church has been restored. It is continuing to be restored through Joseph Smith and through the modern day prophets and through all of us as we continue to live the gospel and try to become more like Christ. And I know that God loves each and every one of us, and I say the same.

Cameron Hales: Same Jesus Christ. Amen.

Justin Barton: Amen. Amen. Thank you so much, Cameron Hales. That was fantastic. It's been super meaningful for me. I hope it's been helpful and meaningful for you. For sure. Thank you so much for having me.